A Look at Christian Themes in our Favorite Shows & Movies | Kedoshim Initiative Podcast Ep. 3
- Xavier Alleyne
- Dec 10, 2023
- 11 min read
In our third episode of the Kedoshim Initiative Podcast, Xavier delves into the responses from our community survey, exploring 'The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly' of Christian allegories and themes in our favorite media. Episode can be listened to on Spotify and YouTube.
In this blog post, we compiled some of the questions and responses, highlighted in the during the Podcast. To hear all the questions and responses from the form, be sure to check out the Podcast.
What is the first thought that comes into your mind when you see this picture?
Responses
Justice league
Misguided Christian representation
Syncretistic nonsense
The attempt to address Christianity in comics and shows is admirable can shows cracks when inserting it into a larger superhero world.
These two are put forward as champions of their respective sides much like Pharoah represented the gods of Egypt and Moses represented God Almighty
This one is a bit complicated. It shows that Christianity is respected and valid since the following scene has him go through the whole Lord’s Prayer from start to finish; he also states that his faith in God helped him to get through the trial of being under control of a powerful magical pagan being for the sake of his daughter (which shows his love & dedication for her wellbeing) & for the greater good. It doesn’t show that Christianity is the one true belief because the ankh represents a pagan religion and with how they are paralleled in this image/scene makes it seem that this religion is equal to Christianity. They make it seem like it is a valid path to God when it clearly is not because the owner of the helm (who it belongs to, not the wearer) is godless and forever owned/in debt to his pagan gods. He cannot pass on to the afterlife (literally keeping him from God; if that is where he’d end up) since he (his soul) is bound to the helm making him an eternal “guardian” (when in actuality he is enslaved indefinitely to serve the wills & desires of his pagan gods). I liked or rather enjoyed the representation of God & Christianity, but it felt hollow after thinking about it because this is the only instance where they mention & acknowledge God outright; the rest of the TV Show (in seasons 3 & 4 specifically) make it a priority to show and highlight things of the world (LGBTQ+ and etc.) that do not align with God’s word at all. (This show and DC Comics in general, are some of if not my most favourite pieces of fiction).
What is the first thought that comes into your mind when you see this picture?
Reponses
Apocalypse is an allegory for the beast and or the false prophets. his army is led by the 4 horsemen of the apocalypse so why would the false prophet not make people believe he is god. just because a charter says some doesn't mean its true.
It's shallow syncretism and not biblical.
A lazy attempt to say all religions are the same.
Lacking knowledge and understanding of God
False God. I didn't not watch the movie for this reason.
Hollywood will find any excuse to Villainize the God of the Bible.
That it seems just because Apocalypse is the origin point of mutants in Marvel he is somehow seen as God or a god. When he is sorely mistaken about how he sees himself and the people that worship him too. He is a false prophet/idol that should not be worshipped. At the end of the day, just because he is a mutant doesn't mean he is not a human; as with being a human comes sin, which he is abundantly capable of and actively pursues (mainly pride and greed since he seems himself as some sort of God & wants to attain pure power).
What book in the bible does this image remind you of? It is actually taken from a the recent "Immortal Hulk" comic line where Hulk meets 'God' in Hell (The One Above All).
Responses
Job.
Not sure.
At what point will say that a piece of fiction is being "Blasphemous towards God". And we are not referring to the Unforgivable sin of Mark 3:28. But rather the modern definition of the word which means; intentionally showing lack of respect to God or to a religion
Responses
There is no clear point, I would have to take it as it comes
If it makes a claim about God or Jesus that is contrary to the bible. but if it is a fake god they make or a god allegory I think its fine. God himself use allegories so some level mist be ok
When the work doesn't honestly portray Christianity within the world of the story, or if the story only focuses on Satan without any counter to it.
Depends on if it is ignorantly blasphemous or maliciously blasphemous. Blasphemy in my mind boils down to a misrepresentation of the Triune God or the things pertaining to His domain (Heaven and Hell, the Bible, angels) or of Satan and the demons. Some writers are ignorant in their depictions, pulling from many world religions to give their impression of good and evil, the gravity of spiritual matters and the role of ‘gods’ (in other words, not intentionally representing the Judeo-Christian idea of God in any way, but still being wrong in their understanding of the Divine.) However, it is plain to see when writers misrepresent God and the things of God with malice or flippancy, intentionally casting a shadow of hatred, deceit, and/or emasculation over His attributes; alternatively, when Satan, demons, evil spirits etc. are portrayed as “actually the heroes” or misunderstood, or are supported in their evil deeds rather than hated for them. (Naturally, representing God 100% accurately but mocking Him anyway is also terrible blasphemy, though that’s a rarer occurrence.)
Optional Question as the Clip is 6 Minutes Long
Back in 1973 Marvel Writer and Artist; Steve Englehart & Frank Brunner had a confrontation with Stan Lee on a Doctor Strange comic. The comic introduced a being that was intentionally meant to be a Twist of the "Christian God." Stan Lee at the time did not like the connotation and advised them to make retraction in an upcoming comic. Instead they hatched a plan to justify their intentional twist of the God of the Bible. Good Fight Ministries has a snippet explaining this event.
Did you know about this and what are your thoughts?
Reponses
I did not know of this. It strikes me as another example of a non-Christian author handling a biblical story in a disrespectful and blasphemous way.
Did not know. To be frank this is blatant blasphemy at its worst. It simultaneously mocks the character of God and God himself. For the creators to go so far as to falsify evidence to get Stan Lee off their backs reminds me of how the Pharisees brought false testimony against Jesus and further on the apostles. It is no means a case of ignorance but arrogance as they had full knowledge of what they were doing.
I had heard of this before in one of your videos. The fact that they knew they would get in trouble, so they deceived their bosses with that letter shows they knew it was wrong from the start. Theologically, there are many reasons to discount this sorcerer as anything like YHWH. Most glaring is the fact that the True God must be causeless. He is eternal. This sorcerer had a beginning. His power level is also well below the true God. Finally, being a finite being, the sorcerer still exists within time even as he travels through time.
Until recently (watching your videos), I was not aware, as my exposure to hero media is more in animation/film than comics. I believe it’s very telling when men feel like they have to lie and cheat to force their unfavorable idea of Judeo-Christian belief in front of unsuspecting readers. They tread the line too closely by making it unclear (but obviously intentional) if Sise-neg/Genesis “was” God all along from the beginning of time, or if he was wrecking the universe of the “original God” Who is absent in the comic. Either way, it’s too pointed for comfort, and shows an unforgiving perspective on Biblical matters by more or less ripping off our faith in order to misrepresent it.
Below is a Doctor Strange deleted scene which can be found on Disney+ (Crucial to Answering the next 3 Questions) Please be advised it contains BLOOD & GORE.
When asked if they knew about the scene, 19 people said they did not and 2 said they knew about.
When asked "is this scene blasphemous"? 13 people said yes it is blaphemous and 8 said it is not.
Reponses to when asked "Why"?
Blasphemous means against God holy stuff so and this was charters going against the bible so definitionally yes
He directly disrespects the word of God by intentionally choosing a verse in the Bible to warp it to his beliefs and disregarding the rest of the Bible. He describes it as inaccurate because it fails to deliver eternity but he misunderstands the entire point: through submitting to God & following his word to the best of our ability and encouraging others to do the same, is the path to God & thus, eternity (Heaven); if you are not a faithful & humble follower of God, you will never find the path to eternity because through God is the only way. The icing on the cake was him putting his pagan ritual pages on the Bible to show how much he does not care about or understand the word of God. The icing on the cake was him putting his pagan ritual papers on top of The Bible to further display his utter lack of understanding and contempt of the word of God. He also very much killed an innocent faithful man of God (splattering his blood all over the Bible & pulpit) to prove a point he cannot witness since he does not have control over whether that man’s soul goes to Heaven (eternity) or not; so not only was the death of that man pointless, it is sin to murder, especially an innocent (which that man is, as far as we know).
My answer is yes and POSSIBLY no, with a big condition attached to whether the “no” counts or not. If the villain is depicted to be a villain in all points (I have not watched the film) and the possibility is left open that he is wrong about the afterlife, then yes, his actions and speech are fully blasphemous— however, that would be unsurprising as he IS the villain, and evil is as evil does! Whether the film writers’ intentions, not just the villain’s intentions in-universe, were blasphemous can be discerned by looking at the greater message the whole film gave, and whether the villain would have been justified/portrayed as “right” or “cool” for what he did and said had the scene been left in the film.
It claims that eternal life is not achieved by what the Bible says
The villain is blasphemous, but as he is the villain, his words can be ignored as lies.
The God of Christianity actually does exist in older Marvel Comics known as Yahweh and is yet to be retconned out. Here is one of his interactions.... What are your thoughts on this comic panel?
Responses
Actually this is a decent depiction of God. they are right that people claim many things in God name where he is nowhere to be found. likewise, people claim false things about God and I bet that does make him angry. On the worship part you are not required to do it to not be smite as free will but. so, this isn’t that bad interesting page.
The idea of God having a trademark is funny, but making God a bearded man and claiming he lacks in knowledge or foresight denies a key facet of his divinity.
I have seen people question whether God is like this. Usually they haven't talked with a wise and knowledgeable Christian on the topic.
I notice "bigotry" being among the apparently biggest problems. The product of a weak liberal mind. Classic misunderstandings of the nature of God. 1) He is all-knowing and perfect in His ways, meaning this supposed regret over not putting in the right “failsafes” so to say in humanity’s behaviors is not something the Almighty would have to wrestle with. 2) Mocking God’s alleged temper with irony, essentially saying “see, we told you your God isn’t actually just or merciful, because look at how He behaves.” I could write a whole essay on how quick people are to look only at the surface emotions/actions in the Bible (instead of the full context) and act like they’re holier/smarter/more gracious than God Himself.
Comic...
Back in March of 2022 (right around the Easter weekend) this comic panel sparked some collective outrage by certain comic-book coverage outlets. What are you thoughts on it?
Responses
Silly and shallow
Exodus used to be cool and an ok representation but the X-Men kind of killed his charter. if he was a Christian, he would see why this is bad, but the writes have him throw away his faith for no reason. but this is one of the worst X-Men stories ever anyway.
A poor attempt at trying to undermine Christianity.
Blasphemy, just such blasphemy. They imply that Jesus was nothing all that important and even that He is insufficient, replaceable. It looks only at the temporal benefits of a messiah and ignores the whole mission of Jesus” to be THE Messiah Who saves from sin and gives healing and brings peace between our soul and God, eternally!
The claim of Christ being a mutant erases divinity. Sure, maybe the male character was seeing that as a way for him to relate to Christ but calling the Phoenix Force the Holy Spirit is both inaccurate and a bit insulting as it is God. The fact that Jean here brushes it all off and denies being a messiah figure is all well and good as no mutant or human or whatever should take that mantle, but she still is as irreligious as any other marvel character. I will say the man does have a point in that people will be faced with the truth of the Lord and give it a different name in arrogance and cowardice, refusing to surrender to Christ or admit the truth of scripture.
It seems that they are trying to downplay what makes Jesus amazing, and put Him in the category of subpar fiction
In a subsequent Issue of the comic line marvel doubled down on that statement while taking it up a notch. What are your thoughts on this clip?
Responses
It is no surprise that unbelievers want to twist biblical concept away from the truth and into their own godless framework. This is the basis of false religion, from the pharisees to the Catholics to the evangelicals it is the same.
That's some serious misinformation on Marvel's part. Makes zero sense to me since the rock was/is Jesus.
A desperate plea for relevancy. So, in turn they go for mockery instead of writing actual good stories.
They seem to be obsessed with rewriting the history of the Christianity as a whole as they see many things supposedly wrong with it. That it's adherence to its traditions and faith is nothing more the materialistic fabrication by some more technologically superior being.
This is absolutely disgusting, the more I learn about marvel comics the more I'm wanting to boycott them.
Trying to belittle Christ by making him out to be some accident rather than God in flesh.
Marvel Comics' in 2022 had their main comic event of year called "A.X.E Judgement Day" The following questions are directly related to the event.
Responses when asked for their thoughts on the images
Gross and depressing.
Blasphemous. It sees God as just a construct made so we can justify our own action. Scripture was never changed only reorganized (which writings were included and in what order)
Overall, presented as it, it seems pretty heretical. Within the wider context of the story, they're conflating the Celestials with the will of God, and considering that they're interfering with this supposed divine plan, the Celestials are not exactly the agents of God. The fact that they conflate it as if it were in the story, it's... yeah, it comes across as heretical.
Yes, it is hubris. It implies that one can reach a level to rewrite scripture. It also implies that wars are caused by religion. It is based in dogmatic viewpoints that are not rooted in the reality of man being the reason wars start. It fails to recognize that a god create to please the masses will bring evil even if it is unintentional.
Iron Man is right in the third panel. It is hubris. It is the height of human arrogance that they think they can either be or create something better than God. They already claim that the Bible has been lost in translation even though it has been proven false time and time again.
It’s blasphemous in every way possible. For humans to think they can create a God or be a Better God to do their own bidding is downright against everything. What they’re trying to do is exactly why the Tower of Babel happened, because humanity had the pride and audacity to try & and reach God, resulting in the splitting of languages & and regions of Humanity. This is also why Lucifer was cast out of Heaven because he was prideful enough to even think he could be God and tried to overthrow God.
For all the questions and responses from the Podcast be sure to check out the full episode via questions Spotify and YouTube
You can even fill out the form yourself at https://forms.gle/nXcUpHWwRmi7d4CcA
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